Web Casts . . .

[sonofedg]

My last 2 cents, allowing Web Casts would open the flood gates, (can we handle that sort of volume?) not allowing them would lead to more debate on the pros and cons . . . which like the US congress could go on forever . . .

[rspencer]

Oh, any change can/will brew up a shitstorm. You should read the minidisc thread. In this case, some will oppose webcasts...the others who support them will oppose any proposed restrictions. We try to meet up with the rest of the people somewhere in the middle.

[pawel]

Let me add 2c as I am co-author of TTD rules on video

Originally Posted by TriState

UberDemon is right. There are no significant differences between a digitally captured HDTV broadcast and a digitally captured HD webcast.

No, in most cases there is a big difference, at least for materials coming from Europe: TV video bitrate is higher but at least 50%. Audio: vary. Have in mind that many webcasts have audio compressed (AAC) to and often below 160 kbps and sampling frequency 44.1 kHz, which is much worse than i.e. (minimum) Dolby Digital (AC3) 190 kbps / 48 kHz. Most digital TV broadcasts compress audio to 384 or 448 kbps and always at 48 kHz.

I wouldn't give a shit to a webcast which has 128 kbps AAC.

Originally Posted by TriState

Both situations are capturing a lossy video (and often lossy audio) source and writing it to a container (like mkv).

Audio is always lossy. None TV nor streaming site offer audio in uncompressed PCM format nowadays. Uncompressed TV audio comes from the analogue era of broadcasts and captures - gone since late 90's. Of course there are re-captures of old VHS tapes which have audio in wave format, and mandatory sampled at 48 kHz.

Originally Posted by TriState

Rewriting the rules to state a minimum bitrate, resolution, and lineage requirements would be a much more rational approach.

Agree. However, there always be a problem with some webcasts. I don't know why but AAC audio format not always provides info about its bitrate - none program I know returns the data. Then, except your ears, the only possibility to check how much it is compressed is to see its spectral frequency graph.
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BTW: it would be nice to include in this discussion Digital Audio Broadcast (DAB) as it is the same issue like webcasts vs. TV. I prefer DAB captures of 320 kbps/48 kHz over analogue FM > digital > flac. DVB-T/DVB-S DABs are less noisy, and often have better dynamic range than off-air captures.

Cheers,
Pawel

[sonofedg]

What are the Specs for Dime Webcasts?

[rspencer]

Originally Posted by sonofedg

What are the Specs for Dime Webcasts?

We don't base our standards on other sites. There are things DIME allows that we do not, and vice versa. But, to answer your question, here's the gist (DIME doesn't have a well-defined policy either):

Regarding digital stream sources

Note: This section pertains to captures of streamed digital audio sources such as satellite broadcasts, webcasts, HD Radio, and the audio portion of digital television dish reception. See elsewhere on this page for policies covering material already captured or circulating as lossy digital files or the audio content of a digital video file or of a video on DVD.

Nearly all digital broadcasts and webcasts carry lossily compressed content. For some examples, broadcasts bearing acronyms such as DVB, DAB, and ADR or carried on networks like Sky Digital and Freeview are lossily compressed digital streams. Despite being lossy, they may be shared on DIME, provided that

No higher-bitrate digicast source is known to be at the trading community's disposal;
The description on the torrent's page and the internal info file of the torrent state both the compression format and the bit rate of the broadcast stream;
and
either ...

Preferably, the lossily compressed material is shared in its original compressed format, even if that prevents dividing it into tracks;
or
If the stream was transmitted at a bit rate of 192 kb/s or greater (for spoken [but music-related] content, 64 kb/s or greater), it may be shared in a conversion to a lossless compression format.

This provision is a special relaxation of DIME's standard losslessness requirement. If the bit rate and the codec are not stated, or if the torrent's information does not acknowledge its descent from a digital stream, then it does not qualify for this relaxation, and if the material proves lossy, the torrent may be banned for lossiness or lack of information or both.

[sonofedg]

In other words, it's evolving faster then we can keep up with it, My two pennies tells me to ride out this HUGE media Upgrade . . . and then pick up the pieces after the hype dies down . . .

[mwonter]

Good post, and probably spot on.

My guess is that this streaming issue will eventually have a streaming solution, i.e.,some place where these webcast streams can be archived and then accessed 24/7 without the use of bit torrent and without the need to archive them on your machine.

ymmv

[sonofedg]

And its name is, U-Tube, . . .