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| Lossy or Lossless? Please use this forum to post spectral and frequency analysis posts about shows you have your doubts about. |
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#1
2012-08-06, 04:42 AM
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DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
I decided to rip the audio track of some of my Sabbath DVDs with PCM audio.
To my surprise several of them seem to be lossy and not lossless. Some of these DVDs are old enough that they obviousely was taped using analog video cameras and then transfered to dvd. Ill post some Spectral analysis pictures of various DVDs and hope someone can help me determine if they are lossy or lossless. Ill also post links to the wav track and a 15 second excerpt of the wav track if anyone should feel inspired and want to download and do analysis from scratch themselves. EDIT: its obvious the last one, 1999 01 12 is lossy, so unless you think otherwise, no need for help on that one 1975 09 04 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/01Z0MNDRY5W 1975 09 04 http://www.packupload.com/NH77NDHNLUJ 1970 12 19 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/GOLB26ZI8TN 1970 12 19 http://http://www.packupload.com/WPB1O54P5QQ 1989 11 25 http://www.packupload.com/EMA2T700I1M 1989 11 25 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/MMCPKFTF433 1992 06 23 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/W4G5QM1418S 1992 06 23 http://www.packupload.com/ZA35H072L12 1992 09 12 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/S0BH1VH2655 1992 09 12 http://www.packupload.com/7PLR80XYSBM 1992 11 15 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/O2C4ADX6FXH 1992 11 15 http://www.packupload.com/4ONW95P2IU9 1998 06 13 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/NDE4Z13EHXR 1998 06 13 http://www.packupload.com/WZLYQRY16NU 1998 06 30 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/SZ3JB8BHR81 1998 06 30 http://www.packupload.com/ZRQ2AE1M5Z6 1999 01 12 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/IM3GL1NAMRN 1999 01 12 http://www.packupload.com/7DU6AWLOQ6Q 2001 06 08 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/3Q20U3H4X3G 2001 06 08 http://www.packupload.com/SOB285GEJGC 2004 08 26 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/UHO3MB43C1T 2004 08 26 http://www.packupload.com/DESG53H2982 2005 06 29 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/O3N5SJIUNZP 2005 06 29 http://www.packupload.com/DB671MZEBXK 2012 05 19 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/YF8N7GPGQ3D 2012 05 19 http://www.packupload.com/0AE4OKUFA0I First ill post one that is obviousely lossy and one that is (as far as I can tell) lossless. 1992 06 30 Lossy Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spctral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  2004 07 10 Lossless Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  These below are the ones im wondering about: 2001 06 08 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis 2001 06 08 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/3Q20U3H4X3G 2001 06 08 http://www.packupload.com/SOB285GEJGC 2004 08 26 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  2004 08 26 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/UHO3MB43C1T 2004 08 26 http://www.packupload.com/DESG53H2982 2005 06 29 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  2005 06 29 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/O3N5SJIUNZP 2005 06 29 http://www.packupload.com/DB671MZEBXK 2012 05 19 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  2012 05 19 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/YF8N7GPGQ3D 2012 05 19 http://www.packupload.com/0AE4OKUFA0I 1970 12 19 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1970 12 19 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/GOLB26ZI8TN 1970 12 19 http://http://www.packupload.com/WPB1O54P5QQ 1975 09 04 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1975 09 04 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/01Z0MNDRY5W 1975 09 04 http://www.packupload.com/NH77NDHNLUJ 1989 11 25 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1989 11 25 http://www.packupload.com/EMA2T700I1M 1989 11 25 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/MMCPKFTF433 1992 06 23 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1992 06 23 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/W4G5QM1418S 1992 06 23 http://www.packupload.com/ZA35H072L12 1992 09 12 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1992 09 12 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/S0BH1VH2655 1992 09 12 http://www.packupload.com/7PLR80XYSBM 1992 11 15 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1992 11 15 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/O2C4ADX6FXH 1992 11 15 http://www.packupload.com/4ONW95P2IU9 1998 06 13 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1998 06 13 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/NDE4Z13EHXR 1998 06 13 http://www.packupload.com/WZLYQRY16NU 1998 06 30 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1998 06 30 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/SZ3JB8BHR81 1998 06 30 http://www.packupload.com/ZRQ2AE1M5Z6 1999 01 12 Frequency Analysis  Unzoomed Spectral Analysis  Zoomed Spectral Analysis  1999 01 12 excerpt http://www.packupload.com/IM3GL1NAMRN 1999 01 12 http://www.packupload.com/7DU6AWLOQ6Q No members have liked this post.
Last edited by vold911; 2012-08-07 at 07:59 AM. 
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#2
2012-08-07, 03:07 AM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Hey there vold911.
It would be helpful is you had FA's for these. But just looking at what you posted I'd say: 1992-06-30: Lossy. It's compressed to the shithouse. Also, the equipment used would add to this response. 1970-12-19: Equipment used would give you this. 1975-09-04: Equipment used would give you this. 1998-06-13: Compressed 1999-01-12: More lossy than compressed (both actually). Unusual that it has a 14kHz cut-off. The rest are lossless! Can you please post FA's for the above. I'm curious.
__________________
" Your tin cup and string "recorder" is worse than a Zoom, which is saying a lot". No members have liked this post.
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#3
2012-08-07, 04:23 AM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Quote:
1975-09-04: Equipment used would give you this. what do you mean by this? do you mean the equipment used would give this lossy or lossless result? and whats the difference between compressed and lossy? lossy is lossy, but does compressed mean lossy because its compressed or what? No members have liked this post.
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#4
2012-08-07, 05:50 AM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Quote:
In regards to these 70's shows (which I'm guessing were/are analogue recordings:- "Equipment used would give you this"= the recorder+mics+pre-amp(if used) that was used to tape the show. Different combinations of equipment will give you different results. Also, different combinations of the settings of the equipment used will add to the mess. 1970-12-19 + 1975-09-04 are lossless but the quality of the recording (the fullness of the audio spectrum through to @ 20 kHz and above (which are useless to us humans), compared to what you can find nowadays, is different. Lossy= Quote:"Lossy compression is a data reduction method that reduces the amount of data during the coding process, but retains enough information to be useful. For example, an MP3 file is a lossy music file that discards some of the original data but is still acceptable for music listening. The advantage of lossy compression is that the music file takes much less storage space." Basically lossy is the loss of information (that cannot be returned to the individual file). You can compress a file without making it lossy but too much compression will make it lossy. Look it up on Wikipedia!
__________________
" Your tin cup and string "recorder" is worse than a Zoom, which is saying a lot". No members have liked this post.
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#5
2012-08-07, 06:09 AM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Most of those look lossless.
A couple are obviously lossy, but maybe just that source was all they could get. The lines just below 16khz on several of them is common to see in analog transfers and is the noise generated by the flyback in a CRT. They went with PCM because, it seems, most of them are lossless transfers. The ones that aren't are just in that format to match the rest of the compilation.
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"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26 Torrent Help: seed policy | MiniDisc ban | seed guide | Ripping |checksum (st5 ffp) | restricted bands | software | download
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#6
2012-08-07, 06:57 AM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Quote:
ill post FA now No members have liked this post.
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#7
2012-11-07, 05:34 PM
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Re: DVD PCM Audio track rips, lossy?
Just to be clear (or to complicate things - haha) compression can mean two entirely different things:
Audio compression refers to the limiting of dynamics (loud vs. quiet passages), taking soft sounds and making them louder and louder passages are made a little less loud so that there is little change in volume levels across an entire recording. Data compression refers to making a lossless recording fit into a smaller file format, i.e.: taking a .wav file and turning it into an eMPty3 file. Neither one is really that good, but in this case it's the data compression that is REALLY our enemy here!
__________________
"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." - Dr. Hunter S. Thompson (1937-2005) No members have liked this post.
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